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MCP X tipping on ground... the questions start here!


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Tom Lauten
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Location: Inverness, Scotland. 47 and counting...

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:29 am
PostPost subject: MCP X tipping on ground... the questions start here!
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I have heard that the MCP X is prone to a tipping effect on take off.

Mine seems to nearly tip over when it is on it's skids on early spool up. Is this normal? It, in fact, seems pretty roll-prone all the time on the skids. It seems to get kind of get stuck in a severe "nose to the ground" position as well as side to side leaning. Is this an effect of the flybarless system when "grounded"?
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Hawzzy
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:47 am
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I have noticed the EXACT same thing...ive had mine since thurs....and ive noticed that during spool up....the swash starts leaning all over and i HAVE to correct it.......the weird thing is that in the manual ...it states NOT to add any cyclic during takeoff for FEAR OF TIPPING!!!!!
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Tom Lauten
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 4:09 pm
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I have been reading that this is fairly common and IS (at least in part) a function of the flybarless system.

The advice seems to centre around getting airborn asap and letting the electronics orient themselves.
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nick_onelove
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:38 pm
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You took the words right out of my mouth Tom. I just get off the ground as soon as possible. High power takeoffs look cool anyway. Very Happy

The manual says not to try and give cyclic corrections on the ground because its very easy to over-correct and make the porblem worse, as you two have probably noticed.

However, I've found that if you're close enough to see the heli well and give it very subtle cyclic corrections, you can stay on the ground indefinitely.

And like I mentioned in the previous thread, the Eflite mSR training gear will fit the mCP X perfectly if you're really having problems.
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Tom Lauten
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:19 pm
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Just tried it again and it just automatically starts leaning left...it's very weird. No amount of subtle cyclic seems to do anything but make it worse.

I have had to dial the DR/EXPO down a great deal just so I can do ANYTHING with it. I'm down to an embarassing 30%!! I think I can cope OK-ish. I have also just bought another set of "fast" blades and a training gear set... I have no illusions as to my inability!

I must say I did give it a try outdoors the other day in a mild breeze and I can see how a CP heli can cope with wind SOOOOOOO much better than a flybar model like the MSR or SR120 especially.

I hope I get the training gear tomorrow as I am losing my initial confidence with the MCPX and I want to get that back by having some modest positive flights... if possible.
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nick_onelove
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:50 pm
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Tom Lauten wrote:
I have had to dial the DR/EXPO down a great deal just so I can do ANYTHING with it. I'm down to an embarassing 30%!!


I'm confused, do you mean you had the expo higher and had to turn it down because the sticks were too insensitive? Or do you mean you turned the expo up to the 30%?

Either way, look through the transmitter settings in the manual again, 30% is actually what they recommend and what I use. When I first got mine I actually had it cranked up to 40%.

Also, what Normal-mode pitch curve did you decide on? Playing with the amount of negative pitch might help the tipping problem.
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Tom Lauten
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:50 am
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D/R & Expo

Aile: 30% - INH
Elev 30% - INH
Rudd 100% - INH

I can manage about 1 minute hovering at this setting.

I dialled out the negative pitch. I'm at:

50
55
65
80
100

I have noticed that occasionally the heli spins counter clockwise ( I think) 1 or 2 times before settling into a hover. Has anyone else had this happen? Could this be a low battery issue?

I found that outside the heli would suddenly drop in altitude with a steady stick, could this be wind effect? It's relatively breezy.

I rebound and cleaned the servo tracks and carefully armed the heli before moving it and the tipping only happens now and again at this point.
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Tom Lauten
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Joined: 11 Sep 2010
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Location: Inverness, Scotland. 47 and counting...

PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 6:39 pm
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Well I changed the tail boom for the extended one, put on some training skids and popped in a new battery. Along with adding +15 expo on Aile and Elev things are WAAAAAAAAYYYYYY more like what I was hoping for.

It's still a slide-y bird but no more than I was expecting from a single rotor CP heli.

The breeze has the heli bobbing up ad down by 300mm or more at times but at least that's consistant. Also, with the training skids on the spool up and take off are steady with no tipping whatsoever.

Looking forward to trying this indoors now.
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If only I could fly as well as I spend money I don't have...

All Blades, all the time...
MSR
MSR X
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120SR
Blade 400
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nick_onelove
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 8:59 pm
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That's great Tom, so glad to hear you're gettin' her dialed in. The cyclic response is so crisp on this bird, I think at least a little expo is always necessary, no matter how low you go with the D/R.

The high head speed and flybarless system let it handle wind amazingly well, but keep in mind its still just a 2 oz. piece of plastic. It will handle wind a little better in Stunt-mode because of the further increased head speed.

That pitch curve looks fine if its working for you. When you feel like you can, I recommend keeping the last three numbers ??-??-50-75-100 to get you used to, and make the transition smoother to, Stunt-mode.

Anyway, congrats on your progress!
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Tom Lauten
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:03 pm
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Yeah, I'm pretty happy at the moment.

I just put a little blob of silicone mastic on the tips of the training skid "balls" and on the skids themselves, helps keep it steady and from rotating on smooth floors.

In terms of D/R and Expo... which is the % number that people talk about? Some seem to refer to either number in terms of percentage.
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If only I could fly as well as I spend money I don't have...

All Blades, all the time...
MSR
MSR X
MCP X
120SR
Blade 400
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nick_onelove
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Joined: 01 May 2011
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Location: Mendocino County, CA, United States 21 years old

PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:55 pm
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I guess technically they are both percentages; in the transmitter the first number limits the channel and servo travel overall. The second number is the expo which just desensitizes travel at mid-stick, to soften up your over-corrections.

I hope that makes sense. Confused Good idea about the silicone on the training gear, I remember the little foam balls falling off really easily. I'm surprised you haven't broken the little plastic hub of the training gear yet, you must be flying well. Very Happy

I went through like 3 sets before I didn't need them any more.
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Tom Lauten
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:45 am
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nick_onelove wrote:
I'm surprised you haven't broken the little plastic hub of the training gear yet, you must be flying well. Very Happy

I went through like 3 sets before I didn't need them any more.


Lol. Well, it's early days yet and I was flying over grass so I'm sure I will have breakages. I'll have to make a mould of the hub and get ready to cast up my own in resin or toughened rubber!

The D/R and Expo settings I have now seem to suit, 30 and 15% on the cyclic so I will carry on with that. The extended tail really seems to help.

I may have to give myself a bit of a break soon and fly the MSR for sh1ts and giggles!
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If only I could fly as well as I spend money I don't have...

All Blades, all the time...
MSR
MSR X
MCP X
120SR
Blade 400
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Tom Lauten
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Joined: 11 Sep 2010
Posts: 359
Location: Inverness, Scotland. 47 and counting...

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:38 am
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Just had some brain storms on making cheap micro heli training gear and parts for MSR's, MCPX and others...

http://www.electric-rc-helicopter.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?p=20460#20460
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If only I could fly as well as I spend money I don't have...

All Blades, all the time...
MSR
MSR X
MCP X
120SR
Blade 400
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